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2004 - Moving SouthI am a 40-year New Yorker and have always been the consummate story teller and ribald character that enjoyed being different and a social rebel that was activated into action by the 1960s Civil Rights movement. I worked for Jack Kennedy and met him when he visited with his followers in Norfolk in 1960. I went to the 1963 March on Washington and heard Martin Luther King make his "I have a dream speech" which thrilled me to end. It put goose bumps up my spine and invigorated me. One of the redeeming graces I found in Virginia was my five years of weekly hunting in Dismal Swamp and Fishing in Chesapeake Bay. In fact, I did become a southern "Good Ole Boy" swamp rat and died in the wool fisherman with my own boat. I shot so many deer they nick named me Daniel Boone. In 1969 I went to Woodstock and had a great time. I was a Hippy type, but without the long hair and drug use and outlandish behavior. I worked in Greenwich Village teaching graduate students at the New School and especially enjoyed the diverse academia and performing arts characters I socialized in Washington Square Park with actors, playwrights, university professors, and protestors of every stripe. It was strange, I was threatened by the Ku Klux Klan in Virginia for my Civil Rights activities, started packing my P38, and blessed for them in New York and got rid of all my many weapons. Two different worlds.I worked in Manhattan most of my life and loved the most exciting city in the world where you can become famous and rich there - I did the famous part but not the rich part, just did well. I found a new life there, coming from the 1960s segregated south to the land of intellectual and social freedoms. It was my epiphany, my transformational life experiences that kept surprising me with new options to live happily. What with its Greenwich Village ambiance of intelligent types, Times Square funkiness, and Mid Town Corporate career challenges, It will always be where my heart is, but New York City - the Big Apple - is a young man's City and very expensive, too stressful for a person in retirement, unless you are multimillionaires’ wealthy. New York has become too expensive and suffers extremely cold winters, which in my retirement old age, I cannot suffer anymore. Now I leave it for the south, hopefully, it has changed from its ultra conservative political and religious orientation . . . we will see.Moving South - Better Think About ItMore than any other part of America, the South stands apart. Millions of Northerners have migrated to it since the 1960s Civil Rights movement and Air conditioning . . . but Southerners they will not become. For this is still a place where you must be born there to feel it is your native ground. Overall, ultra conservative politics and religion define the south, with Mississippi being the most religious and poorest state. In fact, the top most religious states (all southern) are also the poorest, most obese, poorest schools, least educated, most racist with more drugs and criminals and backward than all the other states.But in retirement I did move south again. One of my daughters moved there into a nice multi cultural Atlanta suburb with a great school district (Lilburn) that seemed modernized and somewhat New York like. She got married and was raising a family, both she and her husband had good jobs, and it seemed the south had changed for the better . . . Hallelujah! Maybe I would move there too! I was old and retired, getting decrepit and cranky, hated New York's cold weather and exorbitant property taxes, and because it was cheaper and nicer than upstate NY.I have been house hunting in the Northeast section of the Atlanta metro area since last October. House hunting in the Atlanta area is like looking for candy in a candy store. Beautiful homes are all over the place, and new construction is the name of the game. It’s “building boom’ time in Atlanta and developments are going up by the thousands. We like Gwinnett County which is on the eastern side of Atlanta. It has about a million people, great schools, and is ultra modern with shopping and endless amenities.House hunting in the Atlanta area is like looking for candy in a candy store. Beautiful homes are all over the place, and new construction is the name of the game. The prices were going up as the real estate market got more and more people moving into the area. It’s “building boom’ time in Atlanta and developments are going up by the thousands. We like Gwinnett County which is on the eastern side of Atlanta. It has about a million people, great schools, and is ultra modern with shopping and endless amenities. Bettie and I looked at many new developments and liked them all. The further east we went toward the rural areas, the cheaper it got. Most homes we looked at were going for 130k to 150k (2004 prices - add another 80K now) and that would get you just about everything. The prices were going up as the real estate market got more and more people moving into the area.Our New House in Monroe, GAWe like the Snellville - Loganville - Monroe area located along Route 78. Someone told me about Monroe. They were build large ranch style homes with lots of upgrades. I went there and fell in love with a three-car garage, four bedrooms, great room and sun room, 2,800 square foot ranch. It had the open floor plan, all huge walk in closets, large rooms with ten to 12 foot ceilings, and a huge master bedroom with an adjoining en sweet for a five-point bathroom and room sized walk in closet. It had a sit down marble shower and double marble sinks. All this for 200k, a house that would cost more than 500k in Middletown, NY with property taxes of $14,000 year plus. We bought it and the closing will be in November at which time I will start to move our belongs in. In 2005 Bettie and I moved to Georgia too. Immediately we found the 'War' ain't over yet!This is a much bigger house than we owned in New York and the house feels and looks so different [and better], even with the same beat up old furniture. I restored all the furniture, beds and lamps to as new condition. It is gorgeous here in Georgia, and the weather has consistently been sunny and bright and in the low eighties. Our 70 home development is still building houses, so construction abounds around us. We are forty miles to downtown Atlanta and twenty miles to my daughter's house in Lilburn. We are right off Route 78 in the country close to the Walton County Seat and small City of Monroe. Horses, cows and farms are all around us, but developments are going in and in a few years, we will be just a rural farm area filled with new housing developments.I already have moved most of our things in. I still have several more pickup loads to go. I am amazed at my ability to drive these [many] 900 mile non stop trips to Atlanta without getting tired. I actually enjoy the 13 and ½ hour drive, especially through Virginia’s beautiful Shenandoah Valley. Moving was a lengthy process, one born of 27 years in the same house and the accumulation of tons of ‘Stuff.’ I took seven full pickup loads of ‘Stuff’ to the dump, but still packed hundreds of banana boxes and driving my trusty old F-150, made countless ‘stuff’ moving trips between New York and Atlanta. I also made one trip with a 26-foot rental truck loaded with furniture. I drove nonstop the 920 miles eight times and still can’t believe that I am capable of that long drive. But I really enjoyed the trips and always looked forward to the scintillating drive on Route 81 thru the extremely beautiful Shenandoah Valley. Now we are almost totally moved in but still have a few boxes to unpack.I am glad that we bought a house out in a rural area, away from congestion, but with the huge migration to our area, the peace and tranquility of rural living won’t last long. Remember, to make accurate comparisons, housing in Atlanta, Georgia is less than a third the price of Middletown, New York with a fifth of the taxes. Developments are going up all around us, mostly at higher price points than our own development. Right across the road from us a new development is going in the $350- 400K range. Their Community Center is being built now for a cost of $800,000. Our development started in the [K$] 140s, when we bought it was in the 160s, the sign now says the 190s, but you can’t buy anything now in our development (2018 prices) for less than $240,000. I read recently that the Atlanta statistical area consisting of 28 counties, have been and continue to be the largest and fastest growing real estate market in the USA. I believe it!Our town of Monroe is very nice and convenient to getting around as it is located at the intersection of multiple highways. Last year a Wal*Mart Super Center was built at that intersection, and a Home Depot Super Center [twice the average size] is just being finished now. Of course, the multitudes of restaurants and adjacent strip malls are going up there now too. Across the street from Wal*Mart a Walton County Regional Hospital is being built. Very soon, our rural area will look like Middletown’s miracle mile.Bettie and I have settled on a church that we really like and are thinking about joining it. It is the First Methodist Church in Monroe, it has a woman pastor and a congregation that simply over whelm one with greetings of welcoming love. Using small groups, we are now going through Rick Warren’s new book on “Community.” There were more than forty groups with an average of 10 people per group. All the churches we visited were great too, but there was something special about this church.First Baptist ChurchBettie and I just returned from church. We went to the First Baptist Church in downtown Monroe on McDaniel Street. It reminds me of our old church, First Congregational in Middletown, both being downtown with an older congregation, a huge organ and concert piano with formal [operatic] choir, and interested in supporting missions around the world. There the similarity ends. This church, although very old, is in pristine shape with modern lighting and sound systems. The membership is 900 plus strong with several services to accommodate all. The pews are filled with teenagers and young and older married couples and the elderly. The sermons are always Bible based and filled with stories on living ones life as a Christian disciple. As in the [other] Faith Baptist church we have been attending, the people are extremely friendly and generate a sincerely warm atmosphere but are extremely judgmental, always someone or something to complain about, now its homosexuals. I do miss the coffee and cake hour following the church service that I’ve learned to appreciate at First Congregational. But they are clear on their stand against Democrats, Abortion, homosexuals and women leading men. Ugh! Backward -?First Methodist ChurchBettie and I are still looking around for a church. We have visited two local Southern Baptist churches and were thrilled with them. Our only concern was the strict fundamentalism of the Southern Churches, particularly Faith Baptist. They are very critical of modernity. They don’t believe in women taking part in the service or leading men in any way. I did not have the chance yet to ask them how they felt about Indira Ghandi, Margaret Thatcher, Golda Mier, Condelizzi Rice, Hillary Clinton, or Joyce Meyer. Otherwise, this church was truly inspirational and got your blood flowing. First Baptist, the church similar to our First Congregational, is still on our radar screen.They have the same ‘women will not lead men’ but are struggling with it, there is a strong move to change this position within the church. We tried First Methodist which is located next to First Baptist in downtown Monroe. It is also a large facility with many out buildings with a beautiful campus of manicured green lawns. The Sunday Bettie and I attended the service, and they were being conducted by the youth pastor and his large flock of teenagers. The minute we sat down we were immediately surrounded by multiple parishioners who sat down to welcome us and spend a minute talking with us. During the meet and greet sessions of the service, dozens of additional people came over to welcome us. We were given a gift bag of goodies too. I must say, this is the friendliest church we have been to, and that is saying something as the Baptist churches we went too also inundated us with warming welcomes too. We continued to be delighted as we saw large numbers of young people conduct the service and the message of the youth pastor, a very dynamic man. He gave a slide show and presentation about their recent mission to Mexico where they built two small homes for poor people. Finally the pastor provided a message, and surprise, surprise . . . the Pastor is a woman!Discovering the Real SouthThe South was a much different place than I imagined. The church is the center of all social gathering whereas in New York there were dozens of venues to gather around. In NY we had block and Mall parties, functions at the town hall and lots of meetings at peoples home. The south wasn't the racist bastion of the Ku Klux Klan anymore - well, except for a few die hards - the deep south would always be a racist bastion - and it had a completely different world view than the North. Whereas the North was a basically agreeable and diverse place - everyone got along - it was a live and let live environment - very progressive, working into the 21st century with innovation and new ideas, the South was monolithic, very judgmental, regressive, and holding onto the 19th century. And definitely not a live and let live environment, there was always someone or something they didn't like - Democrats, homosexuals, immigrants, Yankees, Unions, Obama, Liberals, the Federal government . . . the list goes on.Bettie and I discovered that outside the Atlanta area the culture is still much like the Confederacy . . . ugh! Hard rock ultra conservative Republicans and damn proud of it but totally ignorant to the outside world. In other words, backward and wanting to live in the 19th century, afraid of modernity and thinking the worst dirty name is Liberal and even worse than that . . . Yankee; and even worse than that . . . damn Yankee - those devils from New York that want to change everything! Ugh! And to think I served in New York politics for 15 years as a conservative Republican which means in Georgia you are still a liberal and plus a damned Yankee too. Wonderful brain power here.A politician in Georgia gets elected by declaring them a Christian, being the most conservative with an AAA rating from the NRA. They do not discuss real issues like economics, trade or world relations at all, just vote on religious and social issues. Oh yeah, wanting to carry guns everywhere with no background checks, stopping abortion and putting homosexuals on a hit list are the only things they will talk about. So, you can see, for a New Yorker used to intelligent dialogue, I am way out of step here. When I ask the impact of technology on the economy, they look at me with a blank stare. HUH?The South used the evangelical church, its ultra conservative Republican politics and its innate fear of science and education as tools to keep their regressive world view in focus while the North used the strength of its innovation and diversity and modernity to push forward into the future. Whereas the North was suffering from old age, with cold and cranky winters and had few new housing developments and was killing development because of exorbitant taxes, the South was warm, the taxes were very low, housing development was all over the place, and the people were outwardly nice. It was great for retirement but not for a young person who wanted economic and social opportunity, or diversity of life styles with lots of adventure thrown in. Only the North could satisfy those creative high cultural urges.SouthernersI went to get my oil changed in my old F-150 at the oil change place on Route 11 next to the old Maxi Price Chevrolet building. The manager shook my hand and introduced himself using a strong southern accent starting out with Howdy and followed with a string of ‘You' alls’, Gosh Darns and a few “I’ll be danged!” He said it would take ten minutes so I used the time to start chatting with other customers. About that time, the manager, seeing my old New York oil change sticker, asked me about New York. “What was the South like compared to New York” he asked? I told him that Georgia, with its rolling hills and small towns, looked somewhat like upstate New York, but there were differences. New York is a mountain state filled with huge lakes and rivers. As soon as the other customers heard “New York” they started speaking loudly about their negative impression of the state. Southern people generally think New Yorkers are unpatriotic, un Godly and liberal. You hear the term socialist a lot. The pickup driver next to me was very vocal and he screamed “Liberals, taxes, regulations, and unions were killing New York!”He was very adamant, raising his voice and pointing his finger, saying New York is socialist. Gee whizzes! Sound like he means it. Other customers chirped in that they would never allow a New York style socialist government here in Georgia. Paranoid people? Finally, my oil was changed and again the manager shook hands with me. His innocent question had started a rabid conversation between me and other customers and he was afraid I was turned off by them. He was apologetic and very concerned that I got a good dose of Southern Hospitality from him.Down South, [almost] every man is conservative and has a Pickup Truck and a gun (just like upstate New York). The difference is world view and acceptance of modernity. The enormous increase in gas prices absolutely killed the SUV market, they can’t be sold even if you try giving them away, but pickup trucks are selling like wildfire. Regardless of high gas prices and low MPG from trucks, there was not even the slightest dent in pickup truck sales. Truck dealers here have them lined up by the hundreds and sell them out quickly using heavy discounting strategies. It’s a Southern Thing, but while driving through Monroe, men driving pickup trucks always give a hand wave to pedestrians and other vehicles. I think if I ever bought another car, I would not buy it here. There are mega auto malls all over the place, but you can’t actually look at a single vehicle, even though hundreds are scattered over huge parking lots, they are all locked up, and there are none in the vast but empty show rooms. The Atlanta area auto selling strategy is for you to acquire a sales person who will drive you around in a golf cart and with frequent trips to the office, to get keys to open vehicles up one at a time. I won’t buy a car that way! I like the idea of visiting a show room where cars are displayed for all to see, and being able to sit in them at my leisure, absorbing their feel and ambiance without the interference of a pestering sales person. Because our weather is so temperate motorcycles have always been very popular here. Now with expensive gas, they are increasing in population exponentially and I have been looking at Kawasaki and Yamaha cruisers. We will see!I voted early the other day and found that only Tea Party Republicans are on the ticket. This is a hundred per cent Republican area and doesn't tolerate any other ideas than the ultra conservative Tea Party messaging. I was dismayed. There was no competition, no diverse opinions, no debate of ideas, no exchange and understanding of differing values, just the ultra conservative one-dimensional mantra of the white southern political establishment, what a shame for the intelligent growth of the nation and for the existence of reasonable politics in Walton County, and so what we get is everyone marching to the same tune as defined by a body politic of undereducated, unsophisticated voters with one-dimensional world views and understanding of humanity and governance, all to be done by ultra conservative right wing politicians. Well, why is it I am surprised, advertisements would say I am a Christian and the most Conservative with an A1 rating from the NRA as that was the Holy Grail of Politics. There go freedom and our American dream of inclusion and rugged individualism and submission to the lowest common denominator.But it is much the same across the South, ever since the Civil War and the Civil Rights movement, Southern politics have been dominated by race and class with a different view of the world than the rest of the USA. It’s almost like Southerners want to be a nation unto themselves with their very own distinctive values.Today, ultra conservative Republicans dominate the Southern political landscape and they do not represent diversity, just evangelical religious ferocity, social conservatism, and anti federalism, they being deathly afraid of secularism and multi culturalism.There are enough Blacks and northern - more liberal immigrants - to make a fight for middle of the road politics, but it seems blacks do not vote in enough numbers, especially poor blacks, and there are many, who still feel disenfranchised from the system and stay away from the polls because no one speaks their - righteous - cause for them. The racial groups have been separated for so long that multi culturalism in the South is considered anathema because Southerners typically feel comfortable only with those like themselves, and are afraid of foreigners (non Southerners) while in New York (most extreme opposite example) multi culturalism is cherished as the “Identifying Character” of the city and what makes the City a great and most interesting place for business and social interactions.New York City may be the extreme example, but I think it represents what the USA fundamentally stands for, something for everyone, especially if you work hard for it. Since its founding, when the United States has encouraged immigration from all over the world and its population reflected every racial, ethnic, and all religious groups, and with almost all immigrants going to the North; it was found that keeping some populations separate from the main stream developed separate and disparate nationalistic goals and views of the world, so inclusion was a dominate belief of all Northern political parties. Historically, northern states have been more broad-minded in assimilating ethnic differences and now enjoy more social progress and less confrontational differences in opinion, in fact, because ethnic differences were diminished, the ethnic middle class has grown economically, even becoming wealthy, in those societies.But despite the founder’s intentions to separate church and state, religious conservatives are anxious to expand the power of religious organizations into the government in southern America, even if that means undermining basic principles of religious and personal freedoms. The South is the Bible Belt and significantly represents the ultra conservative right-wing Christian political groups who generally support very socially conservative policies that generally fall outside the current political and social main stream of the USA; which cause great consternating after so many liberating social causes have been achieved because of Supreme Court decisions and the social/economic modernity evolutions of the 21st century? They want to enshrine religious privilege in the government as a basic civil right.As an elected New York Republican, I haven’t found any southern platforms in the Republican party I agree with these days [too intolerant], and not in the national Democrat party [too socialist] either. Maybe we need a Third party, or is that the Libertarian in me? I don’t like the politics of the religious right, although I agree with many of their concerns, but social issues are not “Political” issues in my book. I am more concerned with the economy, personal freedoms, terrorism, trade policies, our place in the world, and being the country of opportunity for everyone. So here I am in La La land where everyone thinks the same and I have no real choices, and that is what I miss most about New York, that I had an endless variety of exhaustible choices, and intelligent ones too!Living in Monroe, GeorgiaWe have a nice new house with low taxes, better than we could afford in high cost / tax New York. Life here is slow, nothing ever goes on, neither Bettie nor I have good friends or activities here. It's a day to day boring existence of shopping, going to church, Bettie's Quilting, my volunteering and our charitable things. Ironically, the south is self righteously religious but judgmental and very hateful against many types of peopleI am constantly working on my memoirs, going over them again and again, adding, editing, embellishing [I do that really good] and come away with a feeling of thankfulness for the life I have led, and much of that being in New York. But, you know how it is, you easily forget the bad things and remember best the good things. Living in Georgia has been a great experience, with its warm weather, friendly folks, and inexpensive living, but my bygone agreeable memories come from working in Manhattan for thirty years, which was for me, a continuing ribald awakening where I enjoyed things most people don’t get to experience, was challenged in business and successful beyond anything my imagination could ever endure, and achieved things few do if they lived a hundred life times.Many of my Southern friends are absolutely amazed at my worldly stories, as they have never experienced anything like them. Mostly, they fear and dislike Northern lifestyles especially if exemplified by New York City. They have spent their lives being comfortable in safe situations, have not traveled, always taken the easy way, lived in a homogenous white society, feared multi cultural peoples, in fact many of them think living or working in New York has evil undertones, and are way beyond anything they can imagine. This is something Bettie and I still have in our reserved mind set which makes us unable to totally accept our new situation here in the South.I think many Southerners have a serious conflict in their past culture, they don’t as a rule, think Segregation was bad, while at the same time, they were very religious and let racial hatred run amuck. For the life of me, I don’t understand that dichotomy. There is no serious Ku Klux Klan activity in Georgia (but there is in Mississippi and Alabama), but after 450 years of southern association between blacks and whites, you could say, albeit the history is nasty (slavery and Jim Crow), they get along fairly well hereToday it's hot outside, been that way for the week, in the mid 90s, and nothing moves now. I have been to the development pool a few days to cool off, but mostly we stay inside and camp out from the scorching outside heat. Our daughter Judi and her family drove up to New York for the July 4th holidays, and Bettie and I are alone here. But we are always alone. No one comes over for a visit . . . I mean my daughter and them do, a few people for Thanksgiving, nothing like the 50 or so we got over in New York, but here in Monroe, no neighbors, only a few church friends. It's been like lonely this since we moved to Georgia, its nothing like New York where our house was the center of activities for the neighborhood, church and our many friends.I miss the intellectual and social diversity excitement of New York, but I wouldn't want to move back at this time of my life (early eighties). The south is an easier, warmer and a much cheaper place to live and that is the attraction for us (getting old and decrepit) retirees like me. Honestly, I love to sit on the front porch, take shots at raccoons with my 357, drink sweet tea on hot afternoons and moonshine on Saturday nights and commensurate with the good ole boys about the evil of us damn fucking Yankees. However, my red neck friends seem bound and determined to prevent me from living this idyllic life. Between their Confederate flags, white Christian Right churches, hating all us Yankees and our demented liberal values of personal freedom and appreciation for 'Live and Let Live' diversity, it couldn't be a nicer place.Am I a southerner yet? No and probably never will be. The culture is full of peace and quite, has no excitement, except for the yahoos at Sunday school; it's all just to backward for me to swallow. Even though New York taxes put me in the poor house, I miss the blood and guts of Manhattan, the pretty girls, intellectual conversations and crazy characters of Greenwich Village. I just can't get used to southern Republicans and their politicians, they don't think critically, they cater to the most base bigoted and fearful instincts of the electorate, they work hard being the most conservative, most religious, most judgmental and hating Obama the most and that gets them elected. Oh, and do they ever love their guns (well, I do too!). They care more about the second amendment than any of the others, especially the first which they seem to have forgotten about along with the concept of 'separation of church and state' embedded in our constitution. Makes me wonder how they get along in Washington or maybe that is what our congress is all about these days and why the legislative branch is so dysfunctional. But then I spent thirty some odd years working in Manhattan and there is too much "Live and Let Live" open-minded freedom oriented thinking in me. I am a New Yorker! .I know that if given a choice, and I lived my life over again, I would definitely still live and work in New York and think twice about moving south when I retired. In the Hudson Valley where I lived, there was just more freedom, with more religious, political and life style choices available, where people are not the same and think differently, and we celebrate the differences, and there is tons of fun, a thousand things to do.Yes, mother. The south is still backward but this time not based on race. They are ultra conservative Tea Party Trumpster evangelicals afraid of different types of people and progressive ideas, and are hung up on things like homosexuality, abortion, education, immigration, Mexicans, Yankees, New York values and science. Seems they don't understand and are afraid of high tech implications, the global economy and using government investments to help people and foster business. It's like they haven't joined the 21st century and don't want to. But white southerners are a dying breed, they suffer so much, what with their poverty and lack of education, obesity and nostalgia for a monolithic life long gone by.They have paranoiac fears that the USA is being over populated with browns, yellows, blacks and non evangelical Christians, so they invented this ultra conservative and Christian right wing, who are afraid of everything not white and call it the 'Tea Party' - which is only a southern manifestation of extremist politics.But what happened to my old Republican Party that was reasonable and balanced? They are in the north and west regions of the USA! Now the south is 'Hard rock ultra conservative Republican' and damn proud of it but so many can't pass a high school GED equivalency test. In other words, wanting to live in the 19th century, afraid of modernity, multiculturalism, denying science, and thinking the worst dirty name is Liberal and even worse than that . . . Yankee . . . and if you are from New York . . . Damn Yankee.Bettie and I have lived in Monroe, Georgia for thirteen years now and I have gotten used to it. Actually, I kind of like the area now, although compared to Atlanta proper, it still is a quiescent Confederacy; we are close to everything we need to do and you still see a few Confederate Flags around. I am going to get me a 'carry permit' - all my neighbors have one - all I need to do is buy a nice gun. I do like it here now, especially the Loganville and Lawrenceville communities which are our primary shopping destinations. They have that modern, homey and convenient feel I like and have Kroger's Grocery, Sam's Club and Goodwill, where we buy most of our clothes. Yes, folks, we are big time Goodwill shoppers and I get some great stuff at about $4 or less. Monroe is a small southern town that still retains its comfy and homey character, it is not slummy or decrepit even though its full of poor people, and is quite decent. There is a Home Depot and Wal*Mart here, tons of used car dealers, municipals building, groceries, strip malls and fast food places.Now I spend my time writing and in constant learning mode from the Internet and have written many stories about my worldly experiences and fun days in Georgia.

Moving South?Thinking About Moving South When I RetireNew York is a vibrant and eclectic place. There is an incredibly diverse range of things to see, do and there are a few attractions like no other. NY is for sure a very unique state and someone said it correctly that if you grew up in NY it is difficult at best to live anywhere else. What really makes New York different is that there are so many cultures living and working together peacefully. That is why almost anyone from any where can go to NY and find a true home it is harder for some than for others, but it has been done for hundreds of years. New York City is the immigrant and diversity (racial, ethnic, religion) capital of the world.I just returned from the Lake George area, and as usual, I loved every minute in the Adirondack Mountains. I have to say, NYS roads are really good when compared to Massachusetts where I travel all the time. While waiting in a pizza joint, I picked up the local real estate sale guide, and could not believe the wide range of house and property prices. Every thing was very high. I looked at houses selling for 500K on 20 acres that were handyman special dumps. You can still find a decent house in the 2's . . . but beyond the town itself, the area has become a total NYC weekender playground. The second home market is driving up prices anywhere inside of a three-hour drive from NYC and it’s killing the locals and insuring that folks will leave and won't return. Can anybody have higher car and property insurance rates than us? The taxes are high because New York is very socialized compared to other states, except New Jersey, Massachusetts and California. Just based on economics and living on a reduced income, I have thought about moving South when I retire, but the South has problems too. It’s not so bad here in Upstate, but maybe I'll be a Northerner for good. But I am thinking about it!Upstate New York is beautiful, I have traveled through most of it, but it's not complicated to understand why the state is losing so many of its native sons and daughters. Crazy High Taxes! Most of the state is economically deprived but stunningly beautiful. Gorgeous Greek revival and Italian Victorians are falling down everywhere and every now and then there is one that's maintained. No matter the condition, the prices of homes are outrageous, especially when considering the poor condition, high property taxes and the general economic malaise of the state.The Census people say more people move out than move in, supposedly 100,000 more people moved out last year than moved in and they said the trend doesn't seem to be changing. Basically, New York is expensive and people are getting priced out and naturally they are going to leave. But even if there is a net outflow, the immigrants make up for it, and that is why the population is still growing. The census says NYC will grow by another one million people within the next 20 years.During my many trips South I met many Southerners who could not help exclaiming their hatred for “Yankees.” They would say that Southerners have been treated badly by "Yankees" for generations. That the ‘South’ has been used as a term interchangeable for ‘racist, ignorant, hate-filled, stupid’ and they don’t like being characterized like that. They still remember well the War Between the States because they lost ancestors in the war, find Minnie balls when they dig in their gardens and live next to the battlefields. They talk about living in an area that was occupied by foreign troops, burned, and beaten into the ground from the War. They are still recovering and therefore it means something to them. Never mind who started the war and the North lost more men than the South, and the war was fought over slavery, an abhorrence to modernity! But a real southerner will never admit it! They like the "State Rights" excuse.The victors went on with their lives while the vanquished struggled to survive, but the poverty that enveloped the South after the war still lives in our grandparents' memories, and we have just begun emerging from that with this generation. I always tell Southerners when I hear this lamentation, “The South was always poor due to the Plantation and slave labor system,” which infuriates them even more.What most people don't realize is that for one . . . Long Island and New York became overpopulated from people who moved there from other parts of the country and the world, so we accepted all others to our areas with open arms, and enjoyed the company. The same is not true in reverse of most Southern areas, they think they have some kind of say in who should move to their areas, and since they don't are pissed. So it was OK when all the Southerners moved north for jobs and good economy, but it's not OK to do the reverse.Of course the South can pose its own challenges. I have discovered there are some basic differences between the North and the South. New Yorkers are far different from Southerners, for one thing, they are better educated, taller and slimmer, and more tolerant than Southerners. I don’t think you will get the level of intellectual rigor in the South. Southerners are not the open, spill your guts and go out their way to include you that New Yorkers do. New York is a far more diverse, intellectual and a tolerant place than anywhere I ever visited in the South. Everyone knows that the South is a Bible thumping socially conservative region and there are a lot of "country" folks that are Baptists, only like country music and are suspicious of foreigners (non Southerners) etc. If that's not the type of person that you like or would like to befriend, then best to stay in NY. If I moved South, I have been told to look for a university town, a large city, or progressive middle-sized town, but to stay away from rural small towns.I do agree the grass is not always greener somewhere else but must ask yourself why you want to move? You weren't happy where you were . . . but it doesn't mean you will be happier where you are going. Sometimes it will work out and sometimes it won't. Maybe it will just give you a better appreciation for where you left.Finding the right place for you is the key. It needs to be reminded that fully 99 out of 100 people that move from the North to the South and have lived there less than, say, 10 yrs. are all so giddy with excitement about their new home. It is fresh, vibrant, everything is new, and it was needed.However: Only 1 out of 100 has the same excitement after about 10 years. Yes, there is some that stay forever and even like it but those 99 out of 100 will be honest and say they at least know fully what every dissatisfied person is talking about. Yes, only a few may qualify it with their continued joy but most admit the honeymoon is over, even if they plan on staying. Low taxes and cost of living are much less important than they were from day 1 or year 1 or 2 or 3.I get the impression people are fleeing where they are in search of places that don't exist. There are no Utopias: everywhere you go, dogs will bark, people will drive recklessly, neighbors will annoy you, teachers will disappoint you, you'll sit too long in the doctor's office, rain will wreck the picnic, restaurant food will suck as will jobs. etc.etc.etc. I think that many of us have a Norman Rockwell painting stuck in our head and we move from place to place trying to figure out how we can live in the painting. That "It's a Wonderful Life" town might exist, I wonder if the view from space shows Americans just running around in circles from city to city, trailing behind big orange U Haul trucks!I couldn’t agree more that NY and mostly NYC has everything anyone on earth could ever want or need. If we ain’t got it, it doesn’t exist. We New Yorkers are really spoiled with the best, aren't we? I am horrified at the taxes but will just have to figure out how to make it work because I aint-a-gonna budge.Moving South From New YorkThere are a few reasons a New Yorker moved South during the 1990s and 2000s years, mostly having to do with being transferred there from a City Metro area corporate job and being relocated to cheaper areas because the competitive nature of the global economy was forcing cost cutting resizing and outsourcing.The “New South” was created by Northern Companies looking for cheap labor and less Government regulation and they convinced many Northern to move down to fill some jobs. But high tech and jobs requiring high IVY League type education still remain in the north. But the economic downturn has forced many people to realize that the South Sucks. The Southern states with all of their pro business and low tax attitude have suffered the worst as far as unemployment.These northerners found in the South a cheap cost of living and buying a beautiful 3000 square foot home for 1/3 the northern price with low taxes, having two brand-new cars. Here comes the BUT! Southern people are not as open minded as northern people and still have a lot of hang ups with race and class, are rigidly conservative Republican, and you will feel stifled with their extreme religious and political world views. Another concern is transportation; there is no mass transit system in the south comparable to those in the north. In Atlanta, a traditionally more progressive area than the rest of the south, counties surrounding Atlanta (there are eight in the immediate metro Atlanta region) vote down public transportation EVERY TIME. In addition, more than 100 bus lines were recently eliminated or cut drastically. Some areas refuse to have public transport service because "they" do not want to “mix with other ethnic peoples” from surrounding neighborhoods.I really did feel like the grass was greener. Cheap taxes would be great . . . ummmm yeah except you get what you pay for in the north. In the south, the schools generally are terrible and many parents have to put their children in a Christian school. The level of education here is just downright frightening. I honestly think my SUV is smarter than some people I have met. These are Republican, ultra conservative, fundamentalist, right to work states (so misnamed); with laws and primitive attitudes unknown to Northerners.You just have to find your tribe ‑ which is true wherever you go. And you have to learn how to negotiate conversations, what topics are taboo (Civil War, Slavery, Jim Crow, evolution, abortion, Gay Rights, and any critical thinking on religion, politics, science and US history); what behavior is considered boorish and unacceptable - comparing New York to the South; loving everyone including immigrants, Gays, poor people and Mexicans; being a liberal or otherwise disposed to rational thinking. The list goers but you get the picture.Oops, almost forgot, calling Confederate flag-waving Good-ole-boys “Red necks” is a NO NO! Maybe one more thing, saying that the scriptures are not historically accurate but merely man’s interpretations of God’s messaging, such blasémy will get will get you in real TROUBLE, for He is a ‘judgmental God. Once you learn these things, you can blend in. Remember, the South loves its “Good-ole-boys” - a term used for under educated and well-socialized white men who usually think Obama is a Muslim and socialist, the Civil War had nothing to do with slavery, many chew tobacco, spit, drive huge pickup trucks and live in rural Southern areas, this being a southern cultural network that excludes women and minorities.Yes, after a while you will miss New York and its diversity and forward thinking mind sets, a place that has every race and ethnicity on the planet earth living peacefully together in a salad bowl while the South is still a very black & white place with a sprinkle of Mexicans and where blacks tend to self‑segregate, even in affluent neighborhoods.Discovering the Real SouthThe South was a much different place than I imagined. The church is the center of all social gathering whereas in New York there were dozens of venues to gather around. In NY we had block and Mall parties, functions at the town hall and lots of meetings at peoples homes. The south wasn't the racist bastion of the Ku Klux Klan anymore - well, except for a few die hards - the deep south would always be a racist bastion - and it had a completely different world view than the North. Whereas the North was a basically agreeable and diverse place - everyone got along - it was a live and let live environment - very progressive, working into the 21st century with innovation and new ideas, the South was monolithic, regressive, and holding onto the 19th century. And definitely not a live and let live environment, there was always someone and the evangelical church or something they didn't like - Democrats, abortion, homosexuals, non white immigrants, Yankees, Unions, Obama, Liberals, the Federal government . . . the list goes on.I am glad that we bought a house out in a rural area, away from congestion, but with the huge migration to our area, the peace and tranquility of rural living won’t last long. Remember, to make accurate comparisons, housing in Atlanta, Georgia is less than a third the price of Middletown, New York with a fifth of the taxes. Developments are going up all around us, mostly at higher price points than our own development. Right across the road from us a new development is going in the $350- 400K range. Their Community Center is being built now for a cost of $800,000. Our development started in the [K$] 140s, when we bought it was in the 160s, the sign now says the 190s, but you can’t buy anything now in our development (2018 prices) for less than $240,000. I read recently that the Atlanta statistical area consisting of 7 countie3s buried among Metros 28 counties, have been and continue to be the 4th fastest growing real estate market in the USA. I believe it!Our town of Monroe is very nice and convenient to getting around as it is located at the intersection of multiple highways. Last year a Wal*Mart Super Center was built at that intersection, and a Home Depot Super Center [twice the average size] is just being finished now. Of course, the multitudes of restaurants and adjacent strip malls are going up there now too. Across the street from Wal*Mart a Walton County Regional Hospital is being built. Very soon, our rural area will look like Middletown’s miracle mile.If you are retired and want to head south with your pension and social security you will be fine because you will not end up being a victim of the horrible Southern economy and lack of employment. But anyone else who is still working even if you are offered a job in the South I would not recommend that you take it. Life becomes very frustrating living day to day around people who do not like New Yorkers and hearing the word YANKEE all the time. Those that do not heed the experience of someone who has already been there and done it will regret it and end up right back living in NYC!We have a nice new house with low taxes, better than we could afford in high cost / tax New York. Life here is slow, nothing ever goes on, and neither Bettie nor I have good friends or activities here. It's a day to day boring existence of shopping, going to church, Bettie's Quilting, my volunteering and our charitable things. Ironically, the south is self righteously religious but judgmental and very hateful against many types of peopleNo way people can move here and immediately "get" Southern. The sense of humor is very different and often, the sense of propriety, what is proper and acceptable behavior, is different. I am in marketing so always noticing trends and demographics. Do you remember how popular the show "Everyone Loves Raymond" was in the NE? Well, it was never popular in the South. Why? The humor is so different. The way folks interact is a put off to Southerners (typically). You just don't talk to people the way those folks talk to one another. Southerners are not amused at that behavior . . .Southerners rightfully feel disrespected by the rest of the country. It is totally unacceptable to mock, deride or stereotype any other group in this country, yet everyone loves to mock Southerners, especially Northerners who brag, flaunt their education and travel experiences, which make Southerners feel less fortunate and condescended to. To a Southerner, God and Country come first, unions and people who work for the government are entitled and basically looking for the easy way out and people who move from “Up North” are typically carpetbaggers just wanting to use up "our" resources for their gain.Many of my Southern friends are absolutely amazed at my worldly stories, as they have never experienced anything like them. Mostly, they fear and dislike Northern lifestyles especially if exemplified by New York City. They have spent their lives being comfortable in safe situations, have not traveled, always taken the easy way, lived in a homogenous white society, feared multi cultural peoples, in fact many of them think living or working in New York has evil undertones, and are way beyond anything they can imagine. This is something Bettie and I still have in our reserved mind set which makes us unable to totally accept our new situation here in the South.I think many Southerners have a serious conflict in their past culture, they don’t as a rule, think Segregation was bad, while at the same time, they were very religious and let racial hatred run amuck. For the life of me, I don’t understand that dichotomy. There is no serious Ku Klux Klan activity in Georgia (but there is in Mississippi and Alabama), but after 450 years of southern association between blacks and whites, you could say, albeit the history is nasty (slavery and Jim Crow), they get along fairly well hereI voted early the other day and found that only Tea Party Republicans are on the ticket. This is a hundred per cent Republican area and doesn't tolerate any other ideas than the ultra conservative Tea Party messaging. I was dismayed. There was no competition, no diverse opinions, no debate of ideas, no exchange and understanding of differing values, just the ultra conservative one-dimensional mantra of the white southern political establishment, what a shame for the intelligent growth of the nation and for the existence of reasonable politics in Walton County, and so what we get is everyone marching to the same tune as defined by a body politic of undereducated, unsophisticated voters with one-dimensional world views and understanding of humanity and governance, all to be done by ultra conservative right wing politicians. Well, why is it I am surprised, advertisements would say I am a Christian and the most Conservative with an A1 rating from the NRA as that was the Holy Grail of Politics. There go freedom and our American dream of inclusion and rugged individualism and submission to the lowest common denominator.But it is much the same across the South, ever since the Civil War and the Civil Rights movement, Southern politics have been dominated by race and class with a different and suspicious view of the world than the rest of the USA. It’s almost like Southerners want to be a nation unto themselves with their very own distinctive values.Today, ultra conservative Republicans dominate the Southern political landscape and they do not represent diversity, just evangelical religious ferocity, social conservatism, and anti federalism, they being deathly afraid of secularism and multi culturalism.There are enough Blacks and northern - more liberal immigrants - to make a fight for middle of the road politics, but it seems blacks do not vote in enough numbers, especially poor blacks, and there are many, who still feel disenfranchised from the old Jim Crow system and stay away from the polls because no one speaks their - righteous - cause for them. The racial groups have been separated for so long that multi culturalism in the South is considered anathema because Southerners typically feel comfortable only with those like themselves, and are afraid of foreigners (non Southerners) while in New York (most extreme opposite example) multi culturalism is cherished as the “Identifying Character” of the city and what makes the City a great and most interesting place for business and social interactions.Today it's hot outside, been that way for the week, in the mid 90s, and nothing moves now. I have been to the development pool a few days to cool off, but mostly we stay inside and camp out from the scorching outside heat. Our daughter Judi and her family drove up to New York for the July 4th holidays, and Bettie and I are alone here. But we are always alone. It's not like the north where people walk around and visit; no one comes over for a visit . . . I mean my daughter and them do, a few people for Thanksgiving, nothing like the 50 or so we got over in New York, but here in Monroe, no neighbors, only a few church friends. It's been like lonely this since we moved to Georgia, its nothing like New York where our house was the center of activities for the neighborhood, church and our many friends.I miss the intellectual and social diversity excitement of New York, but I wouldn't want to move back at this time of my life (early eighties). The south is an easier, warmer and a much cheaper place to live and that is the attraction for us (getting old and decrepit) retirees. Honestly, I would love to sit on the front porch, take shots at raccoons with my 457, drink sweet tea on hot afternoons and moonshine on Saturday nights and commensurate with the good ole boys about the evil of us damn Yankees. However, my red neck friends seem bound and determined to prevent me from living this idyllic life. Between their Confederate flags, white Christian Right churches, hating all us Yankees and our demented liberal values of personal freedom and appreciation for 'Live and Let Live' diversity, it couldn't be a nicer place.I know that if given a choice, and I lived my life over again, I would definitely still live and work in New York and think twice about moving south when I retired. In the Hudson Valley where I lived, there was just more freedom, with more religious, political and life style choices available, where people are not the same and think differently, and we celebrate the differences, and there is tons of fun, a thousand things to do. Am I a southerner yet? No and probably never will be. The culture is just to backward for me to swallow. They elect politicians here that don't think, they cater to the most base bigoted instincts of the electorate, they work hard being the most conservative, most religious, most judgmental and hating Obama the most and that gets them elected. Oh, and do they ever love their guns. They care more about the second amendment than any of the others, especially the first which they seem to have forgotten about along with the concept of 'separation of church and state' embedded in our constitution.Yes, mother. The south is still backward but this time not based on race. They are ultra conservative Tea Party Tumpster evangelicals afraid of different types of people and progressive ideas, and are hung up on things like homosexuality, abortion, education, immigration, Mexicans, Yankees, New York values and science. Seems they don't understand and are afraid of high tech implications, the global economy and using government investments to help people and foster business. It's like they haven't joined the 21st century and don't want to.But white southerners are a dying breed, they suffer so much, what with their poverty and lack of education, obesity and nostalgia for a monolithic life long gone by. They have paranoiac fears that the USA is being over populated with browns, yellows, blacks and non evangelical Christians, so they invented this ultra conservative and Christian right wing, who are afraid of everything not white and call it the 'Tea Party' - which is only a southern manifestation of extremist politics. But what happened to the old Republican Party that was reasonable and balanced? They are in the north and west regions of the USA! Now the south is 'Hard rock ultra conservative Republican' and damn proud of it but so many can't pass a high school GED equivalency test. In other words, wanting to live in the 19th century, afraid of modernity, multiculturalism, denying science, and thinking the worst dirty name is Liberal and even worse than that . . . Yankee . . . and if you are from New York . . . Damn Yankee.My advice to folks who are considering a move to any Southern state would be to really do your homework but if you take the plunge, if transferred with a job, realize that relationships don't form overnight in the South, especially in small towns. Folks know each other, often from childhood, and not only that ‑ their grand daddies and great grand daddies knew each other as well.

1980s - 1990sAtlantaI am a 40-year New Yorker used to Manhattan's walk around an exotic creature filled streets filled with Flash Mobs and frustrated Broadway musicians playing their favorites on the sidewalks or subway stations, riding the A train from the Bronx into Brooklyn through every ethnic barrio known to man, a city with ten thousand things to do and one of the best eating at Rosie O'Gradies 11th avenue Diner where the waitresses sing Broadway songs and dance in the aisles. NYC is exotic what with entertainment laden story book night clubs and Irish bars begging more life experiences, hanging out with the NYPD at McSorelys and with the NYU academic types in Washington Square, having a beer at the Chelsea Place music and dance club riffing with the high achieving business and technology types along with the IBM, FBI, Secrete Service, Network TV and Hollywood celebes. Or dancing the Two Step at the Texas Café in Tribeca and most of all enjoying the diversity world problem solving ideas found in Greenwich Village espresso cafes where very creative people - writers and producers assemble and writ large the acting and singing ganja scene.I was old and retired getting out of high tax New York. The cold and snowy winters were getting to me. I got too old to shovel five feet of snow, so I was moving south. There wasn't much going on in the south. It was still a backward, segregated, Bible Belt, ultra conservative a bigoted region. I was thinking about reasonable places I had been too, New Orleans, Savannah, or Charleston. Then there is Atlanta, a more progressive southern region that was working on joining the modern world. From Civil War to Civil Rights, Atlanta has a very rich history, in two regards especially: it is the only American city to be burned to the ground during an act of war and then rising from the ashes (hence its symbol, the phoenix), and it was the birthplace and headquarters of Martin Luther King, Jr. during the Civil Rights Movement as well as the swiftest Southern city to integrate and abandon Jim Crow laws.I have pleasantly been in Atlanta dozens of times for business meeting and product line training every year and gotten to know the city well. We bad boys happened upon a black strip club called Foxy Lady. It was rough, it was kind of like one of rough neck leather jacketed motorcycle clubs found in Manhattan, and a strip club too. A very raunchy strip club. I fell in love with the place right then, was just amazed at the atmosphere. It was the first time I ever experienced strip joint here in the South. I didn't know you could get naked like that. I mean nasty, totally, but hole bare ass naked. They can, indeed, get nakeder down here because they are much dirtier than New York. I never thought there could be such a place. They don't just get naked here. They get asshole-naked. You could tell me to get naked standing in this room and I might do it. Then you'd tell me to bend over with lip stick on? Nope. In fact . . . "Fuck You!"Like I said, the girls were rough in there and I wondered: What if you had some real pretty girls in the club? What the hell could happen then? We tried a new place called Magic City which opened in 1985 with a single dancer. But a single dancer with, as they say it, with a perfect balloon butt. Then they hired a woman named Indigo. She brought one of the first big butts in Atlanta. Just a big round voluptuous perfect butt. You could bounce a quarter off of it." But no one had yet thought up the kind of butts that you find in the strip clubs of Atlanta now, the anatomically impossible, fantastical, warped, unlicensed-plastic-surgeon-designed asses that have blown the minds of people for many years. Alas, butts are just one ingredient that made Magic City into what it is today.Atlanta is growing, I saw literally thousands of new housing developments and commercial stuff going up. Atlanta gets referred to frequently as Black Hollywood. It is, like Los Angeles and New York, a city in which no small number of celebrities feel it is important to maintain a presence.Atlanta is not perfect, it is way ahead of most southern cities, but is way behind to major cities like NYC, Chicago and Boston. It will never have the clubs, mass transit, restaurants, diversity and civilization of the north. It's still a southern city with lots of confederate baggage and I don't think that will ever change. There is a lot of corruption, bad neighborhoods, racial resentment by both blacks and whites, Aids, crime, drugs, gun violence, and lousy education. Georgia is extremely slow! There isn't much to do out here, seriously. Everything is so far away. You MUST have a car if you want to get around because there are literally no trains out here, except maybe in the city. Taxis are very hard to find if you’re not in the city itself. Atlanta has long summers, usually around mid to high 80s, there are days in the 90s too.Endless sprawl is everywhere. City planners did not think at all when the area was booming. They will allow 100 homes to be built in a lot that is really suited for 70 homes, and the new subdivisions have one way in and one way out without stop lights. The place is an unorganized discombobulated mess. No side walks to accommodate joggers or walkers driving is a task only someone born here would think this place is A gem. If you are black and you think this is a paradise for blacks. WRONG get that out of you're head. But I do think that over all many blacks are better off in the south. In fact I will say that blacks better define the south these days. Politics in Atlanta is Democratic, outside it’s the confederacy and hard Christian right ultra conservative Republican - kinda like the black vs. white thing. If you get too far away from Atlanta, you enter real redneck territory. I stopped once in a Race Track in Jefferson, GA which just 30 to 45 minutes north of ATL. I heard two men talking about our president saying, "if that Nigger walked in here right now I'd kill em!" Dealing with people in Jefferson was like experiencing a Jerry Springer episode first hand.Atlanta is a nice, but a very uneven city. It's not a 'walk around' town because there are no sidewalks, street cafes, or neighborhood shopping off the street, the traffic is horrendous and there are few street crossing. In midtown, you could be driving down Peachtree, in awe of the beautiful downtown buildings, but take a wrong turn and on the very next street run into blocks of boarded up buildings with two black men sitting on the back of a Cadillac passing a joint greeting you. The gap between rich and poor here is very noticeable. Atlanta gets particularly hairy if you venture off the beaten path; you'll notice that there is suddenly a liquor store on every corner, people on foot everywhere you look, and even the gas stations look poorly maintained. I use 'uneven' to describe Atlanta because not two miles from this part of town I just mentioned is a gated community, a well paved street, and a few large and expensive houses. It seems like the poor sectors are fairly well hidden, but it's easy to notice the wealthy communities.Atlanta is predominately 60 percent plus black, the south side being black while the north side being white which has Buckhead where the Governor and many celebrities live alongside Decatur my favorite section of town, which is the closest thing to Mayberry and Westchester County, NY you'll ever find. In fact, articles have been written describing Decatur as "Mayberry Meets Berkeley." No particular area is completely wonderful nor completely safe. But in general, there are a lot of great places to live, both inside and outside the I-285 perimeter. Atlanta metro is, after all, a teeming 6 plus million population metropolis burgeoning growth the same as New York City or Los Angeles.Atlanta, compared to most cities in the South, is way ahead philosophically, but way behind major cities like NYC, Chicago and Boston. It will never have the mass transit, restaurants, diversity and sophisticated civilization of the north. It's still a southern city with lots of confederate baggage and I don't think that will ever change.The VarsityNot being from Georgia or the south east region I had no idea of the food "staples" of Atlanta. In the south it's BBQ, Chicken, Hamburgers and hotdogs. Fancy places have onion rings. When in Atlanta, you have to go full Atlanta. What that means!? You must visit Varsity, I had to check what it seems to be one of the landmarks of this city. It's a bit divey, a bit touristy, and a definite fixture of Atlanta history. The Varsity is the real deal . . . a drive-in with car-side service in the old style. They also have indoor counter service and lots of seating. We went there for a quick snack after visiting all the main attractions in downtown. So I got the chili hotdog with onion rings and my friend ordered the naked hotdog and regular fries. Everything was your average fast food, with the exception of the onions rings that were surprisingly very good. Is it the best food, no but for a first timer I liked it and I'd go back for it. Fries are greasy and soggy but not bad overall. Burgers are awful. Kind of like a frozen hockey puck with no flavor and an unpleasant texture. Don't order the burger. It's a disgrace to a city with so many good burgers. The chili cheese dog was the best thing but that maybe because I am bias towards hot dogs. The chili is on pointActually, I love this place! A trip to Atlanta wouldn't be complete without a stop at The Varsity for chili dogs, onion rings and an orange frosty. I think it might be time for a road trip. I'm getting hungry just thinking about it! So, whenever I am in Atlanta, whatever time of day it happens to be, we will stop at the Varsity and have something, like hamburgers or chili slaw dogs. I like them with their crunchy and somewhat greasy onion rings. This is stick-to your ribs (and roof of your mouth) comfort food. Ironically they have a sign that states they use a healthy oil . . . I suppose that's what lends the lite flavor to their very-good fries. Yes, you can find better food, better service, better location... however it wouldn't be THE VARSITY, and as such just wouldn't be what this place is. As I said: this is the real deal. You will get hooked . . . I have been back a dozen times. It's greasy and cheap and so Atlanta! Cheap hot dogs. Tried everything. I had the chili cheese slaw dog and onion rings. Dog was good with good chili. Rings were pretty greasy. Over weight servers looked like they didn't care if you ate there. How about a smile or a thank you? Aren't folks in the south supposed to be polite? Reminded me of flight attendants on international flights in first class. I'll give one star for the people that work there and three stars for the onion rings and four stars for the ambiance and divey nature of the place. . People can you to the Clermont Lounge as a joke because you really believe you are going to a good strip club. People take you the Varsity as a joke because you really believe you are going to a good fast food spot. Kind of an interesting place to check out because it's so huge and has a cool "college" theme to it but that's about it.Clermont LoungeI was the new guy to Atlanta and my ATL. friends brought me to the Clermont Lounge. They insisted it was a "thing I had to do. Located at the end of the Clermont hotel with a rusty and deplorable look, there is the Clermont Lounge with the most eclectic crowd you can find in Atlanta. There was a $10 cover, we paid and went in for an experience that I will never forget. You first have to walk down some seedy stairs behind an old hotel. Then you pass security and walk into one of the lost circles of hell. The place was packed and smelled like an ashtray, the "club" is tiny and dirty, the "bar" is a conglomeration of duck tape on top. To the left there's a big stage where everyone is dancing and then in the back there are tables where the dancers (that work there) are mingling with guests. To the right when you walk in there's a (the one) big circular bar - and in the middle of that bar one dancer is on stage (rotating every few minutes) all night. It ranges - some young some old - all different shapes and sizes. All great people watching!There was a band playing and the strippers were on stage. We watched one dominatrix stripper spank the hands of tippers with a crop, and a lady who must have been in her 60's in this weird costumery boo peep getup.Definitely no place for prudes, so if you're expecting to find wine, a smoke-free environment, and you don't enjoy a raunchy good time, then this isn't for you. The qualities of this establishment is not the aging dancers, but how the uptight folks deal with each other. People-watching is key when visiting The Clermont, so keep your eyes open, and keep your narrow minds in the car. Be entertained. This was the start of a fantastic evening of drinks / shots / naked ugly dancing women / more shots and breathing second hand smoke and finally getting drunk. I got to motorboat some breasts, and spanked them, so I'm not complaining. So let me tell you, If you are looking for a ritzy, classy night on the town, this is not the place for you. If you're looking to let loose, down some cheap drinks, and sing along to country classics, then head on down! The club is jammed packed, Extremely hot, nasty, jammed pack, did I mention hot?!Yes, this is not your typical strip joint. This is an Atlanta institution where people rarely go for anything except to say they have been to the Clermont. The crowd consists of people who would probably never hang out together in their everyday lives, but somehow this rowdy atmosphere is the perfect catalyst for coming out in rare form. You'll find all walks of life visiting this establishment - people you would never expect. So you shouldn't feel out of place. It's loud music and trashy white 'Adult Fun,' where aged strippers go to get the last strip in before death becomes them. The ladies are very unique looking, not your typical sweet young thing sexy dancers. These old dancers are fun and sweet as pie . . . maybe not as sweet as your grandma, but nice! There's the old lady who uses a handheld light-up rainbow ball thingy to flash you her 'camel toe.' Then there's the lady who attaches sparklers to her nipples. There's also the young chick who dances to 90s pop rock, causing me to get all weirdly nostalgic. My favorite dancer had glow-in-the-dark panties that were slowly being eaten by her giant ass as she moved back and forth on the top of the bar. And, of course, there's the infamous Blonde. She is the icon, the crème de le crème of Claremont Lounge, has been working here since they opened. I think she may have been one of the construction workers or maybe formed out of the rubble. She is a hustler but I can't resist, getting her to crush a beer can between her boobs for $5.00. That kind of entertainment pays for itself! I ended up sitting on the side of the bar where the dancers enter the "stage" and I really got to know them pretty well over the course of the evening. Here's the thing: everyone goes to this place because of the quirkiness of it, but sitting there while nursing my drink (s) it's pretty obvious that these women take their craft seriously. The girls are, to their credit, incredible - I suppose it is not easy to get up there and display to the world your goodies - and they do show you all the goodies - roast beef and all . . . frankly they were great.The crowd is very mixed and this humid, seedy, dive bar, fat bottom girl strip club can definitely be an "attraction" for bachelor parties and anyone who just likes to people watch for a good show. Apparently this is also a Celebrity attraction place. You are likely to run into someone famous here. The whole place was packed out with T-shirted big-bellied red necks, leather jacketed motorcycle gangs (no colors allowed) and business people in suits. This is a full-on dive / stripper bar that delivers an amazing fun night out. Order is kept by huge WWF wrestler types carrying three foot police batons. Carry a gun in the club and you are out! Oh and I forgot the name of the dancer I met right away. She was from upstate New York Ithaca and her tits were amazing. Most of the dancers are WAY past their prime. These are women you don't dream to have sex with but rather have a great time with kidding around. There was one who had the tits of a 20 year old and the saggy ass of the 60-whatever years she was. The "strippers" do their gig on top of the main bar. To say it’s a freak show is an understatement. These are ladies who look pretty rough around the edges and some are easily in their 70's. There is one blonde lady who looks exactly like Baby Jane and dresses like a German Beer hag. So she lifts her skirt if you give her money, and it’s hilarious if you are Steven Spielberg looking for a intercellular creature, but disturbing if you have a soul. Not a place for the faint of heart. I did see lots of breasts and pussy and meet cool weird people - all my type. I also questioned the legality of what was going on around me more than once.I will tell you, as an ex Navy man, the Clermont is much like a one night stand in Bangkok or Karachi. A night at the Clermont Lounge will change your life. For a prude it can become painful. As for me, I was trying to put it out of my mind and concentrate on other topics: pulled teeth. Prostate exams. But nothing was going to change the reality: I was on a collusion course with destiny. Destiny was a fat women who was funny as hell and I liked her. Then there was Ruby and Porsha and the woman who sets her nipples on fire. The Clermont is not so much a strip club as a super divey basement bar with crazy people having fun with body-positive dancing women. This place is the real deal. There a side show performance featuring hooks, snails, and a performer who would only accept tips if they were taped to her body.Ironically, while I watched a few women from the crowd toss balled up cash into one stripper's outstretched panty-basket that was working her ass off (no pun intended), a slender woman with a thick Russian accent leaned up against me and said, "sorry that I'm leaning up on you, but I'm a bit tipsy. And, I just have to say that this stripper (I forgot her name) is killing it." I replied, "yeah, totally, but did you see the woman light those sparklers on her nipples? She answered, "totally, but this one is giving it all she has." And on cue, the woman started whipping her panties at random faces in the crowd. She finally said, "I know this one is the best, because I am, too, a stripper. But from Europe . . . I know a good stripper when I see one."I was also impressed by the strippers being so nice. They walk around and say hi. This is literally the least intimidating strip club ever. Between the nice older strippers not working hard for tips, to the super nice bartender, and the cheap drinks, it’s really a great hang out for people that love being out of the ordinary. It was fun and very odd and hot. This is a place you visit to cut loose and make memories. Just remember Ginger is my true love so if you see her tell her Jerry recommended a lap dance from her. I sipped some Purple Thunders (which I'm sure is a mixture of purple Kool-Aid powder and Everclear), and we danced ourselves silly after we spent all our cash on the dancers and jukebox. The second hand smoke was awful and so was the bathroom, but the hilarious conversations with strangers and watching Blondie's infamous beer can trick made up for that. This place is the best dive bar and strip club imaginable. The women are from all ages of life and looks and they know it but don't be a jerk about it. No one likes people like that. This is a business, and they mean business so treat the ladies nicely, pay your cover charge, and enjoy the show. The best time to show up is around nine in order to get a spot at the bar. Karaoke is on Tuesdays and starts at 11. That's a real experience as well. For the prudes and Einstein's who don't like the club, keep your dumb butts in Buckhead and please keep your elite noses away. If you want a raunchy, dirty, old-fashioned strip club, you're at the right place at the Clermont. And going to Clermont Lounge for the first time is like losing your virginity all over again. It's awkward. It's dirty. It's sort of life-changing. But no matter how bad or how good your experience is, you want to do it again to see what's in store for your second rodeo.I can also see Clermont as an excellent venue for sales team building or acquiring a new blood brother or sister. Or contracting Hepatitis. Holy $hit, I need to go to church next Sunday but I am going back to the Clermont ASAP! P.S. BTW ask for Barbie, the really hot big ass blond with great tattoos! Tell her Jerry sent you!I am Moving Out of Upstate, New YorkI thought living in Atlanta city proper was too much of a problematic mixed bag for me. In Atlanta, it's all about dodging loads of homeless people, a bar, gun / pawn shop is on every corner, along with pay by the month motels and used car lots with questionable titles is typically what you find within the I-285 perimeter which is also filled with modern skyscrapers, corporate headquarters, world class hotels and convention centers. I think Atlanta tingles with bling, crime and unnecessary racial sensitivity.I wonder, is it a southern thing that so many people seem to be very materialistic and attracted to appearances (how you look, what you drive, how big your house is, etc.). Atlantic traffic is fast, heavy and loaded with trucks and I'd like to be able to let my kids outside to play without being constantly scared they will get squished by a car.I love small town Upstate, New York, so I demurred and picked a new house in a development in Monroe, Walton County, a small town in the metro area about 40 miles on the outskirts of central Atlanta. I paid $200,000 for a house that has only $900 in annual property taxes that would cost more than $500,000 in Upstate with $8,000 in taxes.At first I considered a move back north to avoid a head on collision with the Red Neck culture surrounding me. God! It's all over here. I guess you would have to call it a southern misunderstanding about how the world really works and the true meaning of life and religion, they are so fearful of those who are different e.g.: educated, non white, or white from the north, those progressive and scientific thinkers, being secular, and blaming them for all for their economic problems. And those know it all New Yorkers . . . The most hated of all!The south has its problems . . it's pandemically in poverty and socially backward - exhibiting a paranoiac fear of the world going on around us, specifically about Obama types, Yankees, and immigrants, but damn, do they ever love their guns and judgmental evangelical religion where they dump their fears within bigotries galore under the umbrella of scripture justifications. I was really weirded out for the first year or two, and thought I should have moved closer to the more liberal(?) city as I figured I'd have less run-ins with the old confederate guard. I talked it around and investigated with friends and the Internet, and guess what, nothing much changes closer to Atlanta. At least here in the sticks we have lots of development, no traffic and still are around all the shopping experiences my little big spending heart desires. And the people are nice too, just think differently than I do on such things like politics and religion - they being ultra conservative to the core and me being moderate to liberal and considered a damn Yankee and what's worse, a (ugh!) New Yorker.I have lived here for thirteen years now and love it! My area is about half black and has developed into a major shopping area, its schools are good and the people [especially the blacks] are very nice. And I have developed a much better attitude about the south. I had a lot in common with red necks. I always hated the Confederate Flag and now I like its "Fuck You" messaging. That's me now!Being a southern Red Neck used to be all about race, but these days I think its about being afraid, backward, ignorant of domestic and world affairs, judgmental, and just plane a dumb idiot with no future. Southerners typically have a smaller world view based on a limited exposure to sophisticated peoples and their life styles, educationally or being well traveled themselves.I miss New York's mass transit, high culture, many intellectual conversations, international flavor, and its many part time job opportunities for a retired person. The place is still infested with gun crazy rednecks - retarded selfish and childish rednecks - driving huge pick up trucks. Before you call any names, I am a semi qualified red neck too, but a nice one, my truck is a 1990 Ford F150 in pristine condition and I don't like socialist Yankees either. And I won't tell you if I have a gun. But I know how to use them . . .Atlanta is an amazing place to live. and you get a lot for your money. It's not the best city in a lot of categories but it's better than most other big cities in many ways. Quality of Life and Cost of Living intersect in Atlanta. You can spend more and live somewhere else that's better but if you want to get the most bang for your buck, Atlanta is your place.